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How much should you charge for a photograph?Camera-Wielding Bus Operators Detain Man For Shooting Video
A man who was standing on a public street in New York City, video recording passengers stepping onto a bus in Chinatown, was confronted by the bus operators who would not allow him to leave until police arrived.
Fortunately, the responding NYPD officer knew the law when it comes to photography.
"You have no reason to call police, you have no reason to stop and hold him," the officer told the bus operators, one who rolled his eyes.
Perhaps they were expecting something out of Communist China.
The videographer is Robert K. Chin, who operates A Journey Through Chinatown where he documents life in Chinatown.
It's a little infuriating to see the bus operators surround him, telling him they were calling police because he was shooting video - all while one of them is holding a cell phone camera in his face.
But it's even more infuriating when some blowhard who works for the bus company wearing an entry level Canon DSLR around his neck, accuses Chin of not being a real photographer because he is carrying a Canon Elph.
"What kind of photographer are you using a cheap camera like that?" he asks.
One who knows how to stand up for his rights, which is more than I can say for that asshole.
Comments
I wish more cops were like the one here, it seems they all to frequently stick up for the douche bags. What's with dslr guy; if you don't have a big camera with interchangeable lenses you are not a photographer? Funny I never felt that way, either before I had a dslr or now that I do. Mr. Chin mentions borrowing a camera, so maybe he is on a low budget or just starting out. I can't speak for anyone else but for me a dslr is big and a little heavy so I DON'T have it with me unless I've planned to take photos. Most of my pics are unplanned taken on impulse with a canon p&s a1000. I keep that in my briefcase so I DO usually have it on me. I guess all those pics are irrelevant, because according to dslr man, you can be Clark Kent, but if you ain't wearin' the cape, you ain't Superman.
Good for Chin and good for the cop. What a sad sack of crap this country has become, though.
Wonder why he didn't press charges against them.
Comment redacted for being stupid.
Boy, I'm glad I've never done anything like that! HAAAAA!
They did commit kidnapping. A quick review of the citizen's arrest powers tend to leave you with the impression that you want to reserve such actions for only the REALLY serious crimes you witness and only when you have ZERO doubt it is a crime because you open yourself to charges and lawsuits for which you have no real defense for..
Think of this situation taking cameras, terrorists, or any other distraction out of the mix. You prevent someone from leaving by force or intimidation, in every state I know of you just committed a crime yourself and the only positive defense is that you witnessed them committing a SERIOUS crime. but you better be sure its a crime because if you are wrong...
Basically you can't restrict another persons movement without strong legal cause. That was not present here..
I didn't like the elitism apparent when chiding Chin for having a "cheap camera like that".
But at the same time, why was there a reason for Chin to state "if you were a real American..."
What is a "real American"?
Somebody who remembers the "Constitution" and the "Bill of Rights" maybe?
Remember, from back when this was a free country?
Actually I recall that the "Constitution" and the "Bill of Rights" are supposed to protect me from my government infringing on my rights, not a douche bag bus driver. Let's not get crazy here.
The photographer had every right to be doing what he was doing, that I do not dispute. The bus driver was out of line, but did he break any laws?
I didn't see any evidence of that.
Detaining somebody against his will? I would say that is not lawful.
Chin had a lot of patience. I would have walked away and dared those assholes to grab me. I don't play with shit like that.
yes detaining someon against there will, is a crime. It's called kid napping or false imprisonment depending on what juridiction your in.
He should have pressed charges on them!
No, Chin handled it very well. It was an opportunity to educate people. We shouldn't always insist on getting our pound of flesh. No real harm was done.
Don't get me wrong here, guys, I am on the side of the photog. But to suggest Chin was held against his will based on what we see in the video is a bit of creative interpretation of the concept, IMO.
(not my) Cuz: "But to suggest Chin was held against his will based on what we see in the video is a bit of creative interpretation of the concept, IMO."
Well I guess your opinion doesn't mean a thing since you obviously have not watched the video.
@:40 seconds:
"Where you going, where you going. You can't leave here." as Chin is surrounded by three guys and backed up against a store front. Then they dance and dude with white shirt turns his back to Chin pushes into him effectively blocking him. Then they demand ID and declare his personal information is in fact their business.
And that's only the beginning. You do know this internet thing is on and we can all watch the video... Right?
If you have to commit assault or assault & battery in order to walk away, then you are being physically detained. If you did not choose to allow detention, then it is against your will.
Almost any place in the US, physically detaining someone against their will is a serious crime. A citizen's arrest excuses the detention only if the arrest is justified, which Chin's was not.
Be VERY certain you are right before making a citizen's arrest, because the consequences for making one wrongly are extremely severe.
How much can you resist? Like you I would have just started walking and dared them to try to stop me. But what if they tried to hold on to me or just keep blocking my path. When can you push them out of the way? I guess the best was would be to keep the camera going so you can prove they were the aggressors.
How much can you resist? Like you I would have just started walking and dared them to try to stop me. But what if they tried to hold on to me or just keep blocking my path. When can you push them out of the way? I guess the best was would be to keep the camera going so you can prove they were the aggressors.
How much can you resist? Like you I would have just started walking and dared them to try to stop me. But what if they tried to hold on to me or just keep blocking my path. When can you push them out of the way? I guess the best was would be to keep the camera going so you can prove they were the aggressors.
Detaining someone against their will definitely is a crime. If I were this guy, I'd be filing a lawsuit against the bus company and the drivers.
well unlawfully detaining someone is another weird law with some underlying elements that (somewhat) defy what we would commonly understand . . . think of the Elizabeth Smart case.
She really was not handcuffed or chained to anything, and was seen out in public with her "kidnappers", but . . .
The element of the law we sometimes overlook is whether or not a reasonable person BELIEVED he or she was free to leave.
You're right, that may not be the case here since it does not appear that the photographer made any attempt to leave, but unlawful detention and kidnapping revolve more around the FEAR than the actual detention. Did he fear for his safety if he tried to leave? If the answer is yes, then through fear and intimidation the bus driver(s) did break the law.
if he would have had a nikon, there would have been no problem...
SO MUCH FAIL !!
Do the entry level SLR's like Mr. Canon has even shoot video ?
He probably didn't realize the Elph was shooting video because maybe he would have thought twice about acting like a dumb ass.
The FAIL is strong with this one..
I don't know a single SLR that does shoot video.
Now, there are some DSLRs that do, but it's not a feature I look for.
The 2 positives here are:
#1 - the cop understands the law and was very polite in explaining it. Again, as much as we like to point out cops behaving badly, I enjoy it 100 times more when they are caught on camera doing their jobs competently and professionally!!
#2 - the ass hat bus drivers now have an infamy they should have thought twice about before they got so heavy handed with a citizen who was doing nothing wrong.
I agree that it is refreshing to see an officer who actually knows the law he is to be enforcing. If there were many more like him this blog would not even exist..
"We asked him many questions and he didn't answer." Well, guess what Sherlock? He didn't have to answer your questions. If he walked up to you and asked you how much money you made last year, would you be required to answer him? Hell no. Three goons trap a guy on the street, and they don't think they kept him from leaving? I'd love to photo swarm these three walking piles of human feces and watch them melt down. Think of it, 60 photographers snapping away like Anna Nicole had just dropped her dress, and the bussies can't do a damn thing about it.
As for the other photographer, I can only suggest he's the kind who sneers down his nose at anyone who doesn't see the equipment competition the same way he does. At to his question, "What kind of photographer are you using a cheap camera like that?", the answer is obvious. He's the kind of photographer who takes the best picture he can with the equipment he can afford or have access to. A superior ass like that guy would spend hours bemoaning the lack of quality equipment that Ansel Adams used when compared to that high tech monster around his neck, and would never stop for a second to look at the incredible art of Adams' work. It's not about the equipment, asshole, it's about the quality/image/art of the shot you get. If you don't know that, it's a testament to how the price of high tech equipment is way too low.
I used a K1000 Pentax for years before I got my first SLR. What kind of elitist asshole thinks that the camera makes the shooter?
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