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How much should you charge for a photograph?New Jersey Cops Threaten Man With Arrest for Videotaping Them
"Put the camera away or I'm going to throw it on the ground."
I got back from Colombia late last night and I know I have a lot to catch up on.
The first video that needs to be posted was recorded in Wildwood, New Jersey last year, but it's only coming to light now.
Wildwood police were harassing a man on a boardwalk for wearing the words "Fuck, I'm Lemne" on a t-shirt, which is a First Amendment violation in itself.
"Put the camera away or I'm going to throw it on the ground," one cop threatens.
The man with the camera continues recording, defending his right to videotape in public.
The cop then tells him to "get out of here because you're interfering with my investigation," which is complete bullshit because the videographer was standing several yards from where they were harassing the man with the profane t-shirt.
The cop goes back to harassing the man with the shirt and the man continues recording. A little over a minute later, a couple of other cops walk up to him and begin threatening him.
"Put it away, you're going to be locked up for disobeying a police officer if you don't put it away," one of the new arriving cops tells him.
The man finally turns the camera off.
The cops in the video who made the threats are clearly identifiable. They need to lose their jobs.
Comments
The biggest problem with Jersey Shore Cops is that the vast majority of them are Part Timers who are hired for the Summer Season only. They include Teachers, folks vying for Full Time and assorted Locals.
The crème de la crème they are not.
I know this for fact, because before the rest of the planet discovered the Jersey Shore à la Snooki, my friends and I used to tear it up back-in-the-day in Seaside, Wildwood, etc., and run like hell from them!
Yeah I agree that was screwed up. If someone is filming and they are in your space to the extent they are causing you problems, make them back up. Once they are out of your way, leave them the hell alone.
The second group of officers had absolutely no reason to bother the guy. Very unprofessional.
JL, I've been wondering something for some time now, maybe you'd know the answer. If a uniformed law enforcement officer commits a felony, can a citizen make a citizen's arrest? I'm not asking if it's likely to end well, but more letter of the law.
And does citizen's arrest work with federal laws, or just state laws?
I ask, because I personally think 18USC242 is woefully under-enforced these days...
I'm afraid I don't know the answer to that. There is no exemption that I know of that prevents a citizen's arrest of an officer. I have never ever heard of it being attempted.
The Short Answer is 49 States only. Your question re: 18USC242 is something I'm working on right now and can tell you that thus far, I've seen no authorization to attempt a Federal Citizens Arrest.
Though at a State Level, it's something I've also given consideration to [ http://www.porcupinepicayune.com/2010/06/arresting-police-for-disorderly... ].
Depending on the nuances of your State's Citizen Arrest aka "Whom May Arrest" Statutes you can arrest anyone for committing any state defined Misdemeanor or Felony - with huge differences between the two in terms of "Reasonable Suspicion", etc.
It is the authority that Private Security Guards operate under.
As someone who has affected Arrests as a Security Guard in Los Angeles (1991-1993) while a Student and then present day as a Private - albeit curmudgeonly - Citizen, I can tell you what I have done.
YOUR OPTIONS / RESULTS WILL VARY DEPENDING ON YOUR STATE
I dial 911. When the Dispatch Operator answers I state clearly and as calmly as possible for the person to be arrested and for the Dispatch Operator - and telephone recorder - to hear : "Joe Blow, you are under Citizens Arrest for [insert State statutorily defined criminal offense]", then turning my voice attention to the Dispatcher I request a Deputy be dispatched to take custody of the Offender. I need never lay a hand on them.
And as of about 6 Months ago, I no longer do any of this without creating my own audio / visual record by recording and streaming to Qik - which in turn sends it out to a few public and secure video storage sites so as to eliminate any "He said, He said".
I've been burned by an evangelicalesque Prosecutor and - unbeknown to me at the time - one of the nation's most poorly rated Public Defender's Office [ http://www.mynlada.org/files/idaho_report_executive_summary.pdf ] before and am not letting it happen again.
Hope this helps.
I live in Washington State, and I do know that under state law, a citizen's arrest is legal for both felonies and misdemeanors. I've tried asking several offices of state government about federal citizen's arrest, and the most straightforward answer I got back was from the state AG's office that they don't give out legal advice to citizens, only to government (whatever happened to by, for and of the people?)
I've tried asking the US Department of Justice, but never gotten an answer back. The thing is, US law is very much founded on the concept that whatever is not specifically forbidden must be allowed, and I've never found any law, anywhere in my own research, that specifically forbids a citizen's arrest for a federal crime. Of course, given how obfuscated and voluminous the topic is, that doesn't mean all that much.
I do not know the American legal system at all, and am not a lawyer. Obviously I won't let that stop me from commenting though.
was the location a public space? or private property, and if it is private property what are the restrictions on camera use. Assuming it was a public space then the commands from both officers were unlawful and the threats of arrest were without any merit. Public view and first amendment means any photgraphy is allowed. The threat of jail for not following an order that is not a reasonable order makes the whole situation a mess from the LEO side of things.
Is there no way to either a: sue the police department or those individual officers for making unlawful demands and threats if those commands were not followed or
b: at the very least go to the police station and show the video and ask why they have officers ignorant of the law. Take documentation from this site and the relevant court cases to show them. Ask for a writtent apology from the officers and ask for a copy of whatever remdial training and disciplinary actions were taken against those officers.
I remember the story of the photograhpher in New York http://www.pixiq.com/article/ny-photographer-wins-30000-in-wrongful-arre..., so can a threat of arrest result in a lesser amount, he was not actually arrested.
Even if you are in a private space and even if they have rules posted up saying don't photograph. You can legally photograph and those photos belong to you. They can only legally get you for trespassing. Your photography was against their rules, but not against the law. There are only a few exceptions to what I just said. For the most part, your pictures are your legal property, even if you took them in the course of trespassing or any other crime.
Silly police don't know about Cohen v. California,
"403 U.S. 15 (1971) was a United States Supreme Court case dealing with freedom of speech. The Court overturned a disturbing the peace conviction of a man wearing a jacket decorated with profanity."
Johnny Law What does your department do with police who "make up the law" when the make an arrest?
They promote em!
Johnny Law, um you mention "Very unprofessional", try Highly fucking illegal, first there is the touching of me, sorry bub, put your hands on me and I will see you in court for assault, do it twice, on camera no less, and I wil have your ass in for aggravated assault. Threatening to throw it to the grown, ah menacing, so nice.
Threatening to take me to take for disobeying an officer, when the order was not lawful to begin with. Something about color or law in there I believe.
It is more than just unprofessional, it is illegal, they should be in jail right now paying for that just as any other citizen would be.
Title 18, section 242 of the US Code criminalizes use of official authority under color of law to infringe upon or deny anyone's civil, statutory or constitutional rights.
Simply using such a position to discourage someone from exercising rights is punishable at misdemeanor levels ($1,000 fine and/or up to a year in federal prison). Use or threat of violence ups it to felony levels (10 years and/or $10,000). If committed against a child, or if sexual assault is used, or if a death occurs, the penalty moves up to life imprisonment (no parole in the federal prison system) or execution.
Section 241 of the same Title covers conspiracy to commit (two or more people working together to violate section 242). All penalties under Section 241 follow the same pattern as 242, but start off one step more severe.
A police officer's qualified immunity would, on a literal reading of the law, not apply to a law that a private citizen is simply incapable of violating (if it did, then the law would be completely meaningless).
I've never been able to find out whether a citizen can make a citizen's arrest after witnessing a felony (or capital) violation of federal law, but I'd love to see how it turned out if someone tried it...
Seriously man, you need to calm down.
No he doesn't, in fact the notion that anyone needs to calm down over serious and daily violations of civil liberties by the exact people who are supposed to protect people is enough to make me puke.
We should all be upset.
Or would you prefer sentences like these to be uttered "you need to calm down man, it was only your mother that got killed in the no-knock warrant on the wrong house".\
This is flagrant and daily abuse, it is ridiculous and it needs to be stopped, the police have proven they will not stop it, therefore we must.
When someone is recording them, they perceive that as a threat to their paycheck. They don't want ANYTHING messing up their cushy jobs. The north east has got it pretty bad with the amount of police relative to the population. I say start cutting the amount of these faggots that are in the department so the ones remaining go after legit criminals instead of hassling innocent people(since it seems they have plenty of time to do that).
I just want to know what "Fuck,I'm Lemne" means.
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